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I watched it again last night, and was shocked more than before at the rather low level of execution in almost all areas, exept for the Bogart's personality of course.Being made in 1942 is no excuse for lack of skills or vision either. Great films had been made before that time.
And as far as the lead actress... I have always found her complevely devoid of any attraction, either sexual or artistic. Watching her makes me yawn.
Worst of all, you can see plenty of early signs of all the later years Hollywood faults in that films, those that some of us have grown to hate and those that unfortunately define the bulk of the American movies today.
Follow Ups:
All I see is poor acting, overwrought dialog, numerous technical flaws (bad makeup, crude matte paintings, awful sets, cheap use of stock footage, etc.) and a script that reads like a bad off-Broadway play. I can not believe that this movie is considered one of the greatest of all time. A few original camera tricks and lighting techniques just don't make up for what appears to have been a rushed and slipshod production. And even if I hadn't known from previous viewings that Rosebud was Kane's sled, the "revelation" that this multi-millionaire lived a completely miserable existence simply because his mother was a cold fish and so he never learned how to love struck me as hackneyed and sophmoric. When the film ends, we are "introduced to the players" through a series of mostly humorous snippets from the film, played over lively, cheery music. It shows how seriously Welles himself originally intended us to take the movie.In comparison, Casablanca is a masterpiece.
just another movie that was churned out by the machine to make bucks.But sometimes a cake tastes better than just the pieces of the batter. Don't know why, but it just works for many people looking at cut-out film charaters with nostagic eyes.
It also was timely in that it was good against evil. Pull together. One persons agenda (or two) didn't add to a hill of beans in that crazy world.
America as the brash rough place full of hope, filled with flawed brash rough people with soft spots for the weak and opressed.
The people most suprised by the inital success and could never fathom the lofty/cult heights were the studio heads, director and producer. It was another formulmatic piece that they had turned out dozens of times before.
But with it being chock full of charaters. Lorie, Greenstreet, Raines, the Russian Bartender, the Jewish Head waiter, the sinister German Officer, the fleeing/hoping refugees, all cut out charaters, but what characters.
Seen it alot. Never looked at it like the greatest drama, cinema or film. Just marveled at the 3 sigma creation of chemistry by a factory that used simple formulas. Famous and good, not by design, but by sheer luck.
It is an American film, with flawed American as star, who sacrifices all for duty and love. Better to have a cult about that then Pink Flamingos.
-- written, that nobdy can remember the composers name!You must remember this--a da da dada dada.
Des
Rick, the quintessential American. You hate him, right?I suppose your totalitarian background makes it difficult for you to understand the appeal of this film.
It seems to me that Casablanca had no significant recognition or following until the 70's "camp" movement adopted it along with so much other 1940's commerciality as high art. Since then, it's been promoted as The Great American Movie, and the baby boomers who grew up thinking 60's fodder like "Pillow Talk" was good stuff believed it.
Satirises Casablanca and has some of Woody Allens cleverest lines
I don't think Casablanca is in any way Bogarts best film, and I find little salvageable from this era anyway, (tho' Fantasia was released in 1941, Chaplins The Great Dictator around that time) it seems like they're stage actors awkwardly not adapting to the screen, no "method acting" until James Deans era, 'tho Bogart has it all down pat
Good or bad, Rick's Cafe Americain has become an indelible part of popular culture
Eric
Tokyo
I'm not sure the 40's are my favorite era.But many of my favorite films of all time were made in the 30's, a true golden age IMO: Modern Times, Rules of the Game, Bride of Frankenstein, M, Swing Time and many more.
Yeah, I get bored easily though African Queen did keep my interest a while back. I don't think I've ever watch Casablanca al the way through.
V,While I find Casablanca reasonably entertaining and well made by 1941 standards*- my problem with it is that the entire film is devoted to getting Americans excited about entering war- that this is a more noble and higher calling than the cafe business and hopeless romance.
Casablanca was released briefly in 1941 due to the sensational headlines about the war in Northern Africa, i.e. to more effectively cash in on the deaths and destruction there. It was withdrawn and then re-released in 1942 to properly qualify for the 1942 Academy Awards. Typical of dangerously liberal Hollywood.
I suppose I just have a problem with sentimental cheerleading to kill foreigners, instead of exposing the true underlying conflicts.
And hello to Mssrs. Bush and Rumsfeld.
Cheers,Bambi B
*the final airport scene was made at Burbank airport with a DC3 cutout in the background being "loaded " by dwarves- and notice how many important Nazi officers are riding in Buicks-
Bruce is right, it is a B movie, and it was for the whole bunch a big surprise that it had such a great hit, and even more with time passing.
This film is a romantic one, and of course you have to be in the mood.
I find that this picture is very well played and served from every actors in it, the only dated scene is the one withe the french lady singing this patriotic song, but with a litle imagination you can revive the feelings the people may had have at this point of the war...
It is not a very good film, but i really enjoy it again and again...But that is another story...
NT
Maybe what I read about Curtiz being unable to handle that bunch, and they all cheating him every time, and doing whatever they wanted, is true.BTW, if you look at it this way, as a film played from pure improvisation, youŽll find some merits in it, and even enjoy it! I did.
Regards
BF
Victor, are you sure you weren't just in a bad mood when watching (the cat had just knocked over a bottle of Sam Smith's or something)?Casablanca is one of my favorites (although if I met someone like Ingrid's character in real life, I'd say she deserves a good smacking!). Tell me this, then - how would you compare this film to, say, The Maltese Falcon (seeing how this is another widely-praised Bogart vehicle)?
I gave at the office!
Casablanca is a truly great American film. He's got some ideological grind that prevents him from experiencing what's really good about this country.
Remember - that was last night, therefore - AFTER the elections, meaning I was in most definitely good mood. It is AuPh who's been pissed.I haven't seen the Falcon in many years, but I don't recall being touched by it either.
Pretty cold and unappealling fish.
In this order:
Treasure of Sierra Madre
Caine Mutiny
Key Largo
African Queenmp
Didn't get into Maltese or casablanca, but I understand why they are so popular. Casablanca as both a warfilm, and as a love story, was not too sappy. I have seen many forgetable, ridiculously sappy and gushy war/love stories from that time period. Casablanca was different.mp
Agree these are all excellent flics. Not to be missed.You are wasting your time on VK, he's got a lot of baggage to deal with before he can understand America.
was that I was shocked that Casablanca was so much better than the Maltese Falcon, after watching the two close together. Although Bogart was excellent in both. He was also in another of my favorites - The African Queen.On an unrelated note - It's funny how your favorites are formed isn't it? Just mentally going through films that are my favorites, they don't have a lot in common, just sort of stick with you.
I gave at the office!
Casablanca is for saps.I mean, what sort of stupid bitch would leave a man like Rick standing in the rain......and for what ? What a slut- marrying some coward she wasn't even in love with. Having betrayed Rick- she then betrays her husband with her silence about her love for Rick- what a slut.
The Maltese Falcon is a very funny film- if you don't see the comedy in it then you are a sap. Dialog fired from a trench broom in a noir orgy of caricatures. The stuff dreams are made of - except for saps, they dream of Casablanca.
"When you're slapped, you'll take it and like it"- Sam Spade a bona fide non- sap of a man.
it's the world's best "B" movie!But "Casablanca" is still a "B" movie. I don't know of any serious critic who sez otherwise.
As for Ingrid Bergman -- I find "Notorious" a much more interesting exposition of her talents.
But, also the general principle applies: de gustibus non disputandum est !
Best B movie ever. Not boring to me, unless seen to often, although it is predictable. Bogart is very watchable in this. I like Notorious much better.About the serious critic who says otherwise, would ya believe some European critic had it on his/her Sight & Sound ten best of all time list? You should've seen some of the lists this year - the S&S list just gets stranger and stranger, but that's a subject for another thread.
Well, I sorta disagree with both of you guys. B or no B, find one movie guide where it is not rated among the best movies ever produced. I haven't seen one such list.The list you mention is most definitely not the only one like that - you routinely see it listed among the ten, the twenty, the whatever best films of all times.
Even here.
Its cult in America is incredible.
It hasn't made the Sight & Sound 10 best, either the critic or the director lists, in the last ten years.Of course, what does that mean when on critic listed both The Exorcist and Mary Poppins in his ten best, lol.
Actually, I can't claim credit for the "world's best B movie" line; I read it somewhere.I think the point, Victor, is expectations. One has lower expectations of a "B" movie than of one with serious artistic presentations. Most of the things that you and Harmonia complain about with this movie -- the predictablity and so on -- are characteristic of the genre.
It is also, a propaganda film -- indeed, an allegory.
So, the net conclusion is that, within the conventions of those genres, it does very, very well.
As for its appearance on "ten best" lists and the like; I take no responsiblity. Who knows what criteria are used by the compilers of such lists?
To make an analogy, it's like complaining that my minivan doesn't pull 0.9 G's around a corner, or accelerate to 100 kph in 6 seconds, unlike, say, an M3. But, if you want to carry 7 people somewhere, you're definitely SOL with the M3; and my minivan does the job handily. And for a minivan it handles with some alacrity and is reasonably fast.
Long as we're talking Bogie films -- I'll put "The Treasure of the Sierra Madre" up with the best of any films, no qualifications, no excuses.
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