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I hear 'F 911' is now out on DVD and VHS. Fact or fiction? Documentary or fiction film? Opening up a can of worms or what?
Follow Ups:
Factual Back-Up For Fahrenheit 9/11: Section OneTHE FOLLOWING IS THE LINE BY LINE FACTUAL BACKUP FOR 'FAHRENHEIT 9/11'
Section One covers the facts in Fahrenheit 9/11 from the 2000 election to George W. Bush's extended visit to Booker Elementary on the morning of September 11th.
FAHRENHEIT 9/11: Fox was the first network to call Florida for Bush. Before that, some other networks had called Florida for Gore, and they changed after Fox called it for Bush.“With information provided from the Voter News Service, NBC was the first network to project Gore the winner in Florida at 7:48 pm. At 7:50 pm ,CNN and CBS project Gore the winner in Florida as well.” By 8:02 pm , all five networks and the Associated Press had called Gore the winner in Florida. Even the VNS called Gore the winner at 7:52 pm. At 2:16 am, Fox calls Florida for Bush, NBC follows at 2:16 am. ABC is the last network to call the Florida for Bush, at 2:20 am, while AP and VNS never call Florida for Bush. CNN: http://www.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/stories/02/02/
cnn.report/cnn.pdf
Ten minutes after the top of the hour, network excitement was again beginning to build. At 2:16 a.m., the call was made: Fox News Channel, with Bush's first cousin John Ellis running its election desk, was the first to project Florida -- and the presidency -- for the Texas governor. Within minutes, the other networks followed suit. "George Bush, Governor of Texas will become the 43rd President of the United States," CNN's Bernard Shaw announced atop a graphic montage of a smiling Bush. "At 18 minutes past two o'clock Eastern time, CNN declares that George Walker Bush has won Florida's 25 electoral votes and this should put him over the top."PBS: http://www.pbs.org/newshour/media/election2000/
election_night.html
FAHRENHEIT 9/11: The man who was in charge of the decision desk at FOX on election night was Bush’s first cousin, John Ellis.“John Ellis, a first cousin of George W. Bush, ran the network's ‘decision desk’ during the 2000 election, and Fox was the first to name Bush the winner. Earlier, Ellis had made six phone calls to Cousin Bush during the vote-counting.” William O’Rourke, “Talk Radio Key to GOP Victory,” Chicago Sun-Times, December 3, 2002.
A Fox News consultant, John Ellis, who made judgments about presidential ‘calls’ on Election Night admits he was in touch with George W. Bush and FL Gov. Jeb Bush by telephone several times during the night, but denies breaking any rules. CNN, November 14, 2000; http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2000/
11/14/politics/main249357.shtml.
John Ellis, the Fox consultant who called Florida early for George Bush, had to stop writing about the campaign for the Boston Globe because of family ‘loyalty’ to Bush. CBS News, http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2000/
11/14/politics/main249357.shtml, November 14, 2000.
FAHRENHEIT 9/11: “Make sure the chairman of your campaign is also the vote countin’ woman and that her state has hired a company that’s gonna knock voters off the rolls who aren’t likely to vote for you. You can usually tell them by the color of their skin.”“The vote total was certified by Florida's secretary of state, Katherine Harris, head of the Bush campaign in Florida, on behalf of Gov. Jeb Bush, the candidate's brother.” Mark Zoller Seitz, “Bush Team Conveyed an Air of Legitimacy,” San Diego Union-Tribune, December 16, 2000.
The Florida Department of State awarded a $4 million contract to the Boca Raton-based Database Technologies Inc. (subsidiary of ChoicePoint). They were tasked with finding improperly registered voters in the state’s database, but mistakes were rampant. “At one point, the list included as felons 8,000 former Texas residents who had been convicted of misdemeanors.” St. Petersburg Times (Florida), December 21, 2003.
Database Technologies, a subsidiary of ChoicePoint, “was responsible for bungling an overhaul of Florida’s voter registration records, with the result that thousands of people, disproportionately black, were disenfranchised in the 2000 election. Had they been able to vote, they might have swung the state, and thus the presidency, for Al Gore, who lost in Florida. Oliver Burkeman, Jo Tuckman, “Firm in Florida Election Fiasco Earns Millions from Files on Foreigners,” The Guardian, May 5, 2003 http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,949709,00.html. See also, Atlanta-Journal-Constitution, May 28, 2001.
In 1997, Rick Rozar, the late head of the company bought by ChoicePoint, donated $100,000 to the Republican National Committee. Melanie Eversley, “Atlanta-Based Company Says Errors in Felon Purge Not Its Fault,” Atlanta Journal-Constitution, May 28, 2001. Frank Borman of Database Technologies Inc. has donated extensively to New Mexico Republicans, as well as to the Presidential campaign of George W. Bush. Opensecrets.org, “Frank Borman.”
FAHRENHEIT 9/11: Gore got the most votes in 2000.[A] consortium [Tribune Co., owner of the Times; Associated Press; CNN; the New York Times; the Palm Beach Post; the St. Petersburg Times; the Wall Street Journal; and the Washington Post] hired the NORC [National Opinion Research Center, a nonpartisan research organization affiliated with the University of Chicago] to view each untallied ballot and gather information about
Actually the Passionate Eye here in Canada looked into some of the things that Moore talked about but not the Moore film. There are some things important things very very correct in this movie with more resounding PROOF than what Moore put in his film. I don't know if the passionate Eye because it is more recent and has pro media types and more access and is more recent than F 9/11 but it was quite interesting.For a start analyze the images of the group who pulled down the Saddam Statue - Some uncovered footage reveals that those Iraqi's were NOT Iraqis - where the people came from in the streets - they were led by tropps - one had a 1991 Iraqi flag - naturally just carrying it around with them. That info you wonder why it's not presented by CNN. Even if people don't agree with it - it should at least be "presented." All this was a very minor point in some pretty surprising things.
Moore never presented this as a documentary - it is clearly stated that it's his view within the first 4 minutes of the movie. It's sad he gets ripped for an opinion.
Carlos Delgado a Blue Jays First Baseman from Venezuala decided to NOT stand for the 7th inning God Bless America - he stood for the American and Canadian National Anthems but simply elected not to stand for God Bless America which was not sung in Baseball games - has NOTHING whatsoever to do with baseball - the man is not American and his personal belief was it was bad to go into Iraq.
He didn't advertise this but once found out he is all over the paers as some sort of "evil-Doer" no doubt the right thinks he's a terrorist loving bleeding heart liberal. It's pretty sad that you have to join the wave of nationalistic flag wavers or be denounced as "other."
Clinton, Condoleeza Rice, and Colin Powell ALL said before 9/11 that Saddam was fully contained and NOT a threat to the United States. Interesting what a day makes. And interesting what a day makes to the bottom lines of certain companies - namely Haliburton.
I watched it last night. I enjoyed it.
As for the rest, you'll have to decide that for yourself.
Jack
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So far, I haven't heard anything intelligent out of any of you. Moore lied in "bowling", I'm sure more of the same was in F911. He is not a true documentary filmaker. You don't script documentaries, or embellish. He admitted to embellishing facts in "BFCFact: Heston's "cold dead hands" speech, which leads off Moore's depiction of the Denver meeting, was not given at Denver after Columbine. It was given a year later in Charlotte, North Carolina, and was his gesture of gratitude upon his being given a handmade musket, at that annual meeting.
Image of a webpage for America's First Freedom (a website for NRA, not for Heston) with text "48 hours after Kayla Rolland was prounced dead" highlighted and zoomed in on.
Your impression: Heston did something 48 hours after she died. Why else would "his" webpage note this event, whatever it is? What would Heston's action have been? It must have been to go to Flint and hold the rally. His NRA webpage" with highlighted reference to "48 hours after Kayla Robinson is pronounced dead." Here's where it gets interesting. Moore zooms in on that phrase so quickly that it blots out the rest of the sentence, and then takes the image off screen before you can read anything else. Guess what the page really said happened? Not a Heston trip to Flint, but: "48-hours after Kayla Rolland is pronounced dead, Bill Clinton is on The Today Show telling a sympathetic Katie Couric, "Maybe this tragic death will help."" Nothing to do with Heston. Incidentally, if you have the DVD version and the right player, you can freeze frame this sequence and see it yourself.Moore fabricated this BS and fed it to as as fact. He's no better than Fox News...
s
If you want to watch a documentary, watch Fahrenhype911. Moore's movie is not even close to a documentary.Moore is a very stupid, hypocritic slob. It amazes me people don't have the brains to see through his inconsistencies and very dense premises within his movies. He should be ashamed of himself for trying to delude people with intentional lies. Hopefully those clueless self righteous Hollywood limosine liberals will pass him over for any more awards.
ps. senator ketchup is a 2 faced liar who will put us all in the poor house.
Fahrenheit 911 may not be perfect, but whether viwewed as a documentary or partisan propaganda with more than a touch of biting irony, it connects the dots far better than your cheap demagoguery! Sadly, you made no effort, not even a token one, to repudiate the accuracy of Mr. Moore's film. Instead you attacked his intelligence and personal appearance (i.e., which in all probability is superior to yours on both counts) without even addressing the very real issue of the bogus POTUS's incompetence!Whether you like it's Director or not, Fahrenheit 911 built a damning case for Smirkenstein's lack of fitness to lead this great nation. The bottom line is that Michael Moore must've done a pretty good job of slaughtering the right-wing's sacred cow ...or would that be sacred BULL... because the level of vitriol you've deposited here (i.e., with apparent Mt. St. Helen's aspirations) suggests that he sure as heck got your panties in a bunch!
BTW, now that Clark seems ready to pucker up to kiss your proverbial internet fanny I guess that means you'll be comin' back for Moore. ;^)
Regards,
AuPh
It does take a moderate intelligence to see the great stupidity in Michael Moore's films. Sadly, he happily gets away with it. His deceptions in F911 are well documented. Clark lists a link below (http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/#ContinueArticle ).Have you seen FahrenHYPE911? It's an excellent film. Give it a view. I picked mine up at Best Buy for $10.99.
...he stole the Presidency in 2000. Moore's film was actually too fair to Smirk in spite of it's occasional distortions for the sake of ironic humor. If ever a President deserved to be impeached AND convicted of incompetent leadership it's George W. Bush. His depraved indifference to the sombre task of leading this nation up to 9/11 combined with his rationalized LIES to the American public about Iraq being a terrorist state and now his distortions of John Kerry's record speak volumes.> > > "It does take a moderate intelligence..." < < <
No offense, but you appear to be very Conservative in this area as well. ;^)
AuPh
...*who are you*?clark
So Clinton's former political adviser, who boasted to a prostitute about his links to the White House, is now a filmaker? LOLNow there's a man I can trust to tell the truth.
Like I said on outside; all thse claims by cons about "lies" and yet NOT ONE was ever put forward. And of course the news shows Moore was right about most stuff.Clark, tell us one lie on Farenhiet 911. One teeny mistake. Then you are entitled to bash it.
> > There are many articles which have pointed out the distortions, falsehoods, and lies in the film Fahrenheit 9/11. This report compiles the Fahrenheit 9/11 deceits which have been identified by a wide variety of reviewers. In addition, I identify some inaccuracies which have not been addressed by other writers.http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1166355/posts
________________________________________________________________________________
Then we have that notorious right-winger Christopher Hitchens:
hot air?
Notice you didn't mention it, only Hitchins.Case closed. Summary judgement. And you're up before the Bar Association for incompetence.
clark
Clark's "truths" are always just around the corner.
Just almost here.
Any day now.
Almost, Just wait, he's going to go get it.
Right now.
Imminently.The man with no facts, just slurs. And diversions. Post one of the illustrious 59, Senator McCarthy.
Here's a clue: It isn't Duilawyer! ;^)Cheers,
AuPh
.
And you amn't.A lawyer would be the first to note, again you dodged, and evaded.
What is the falsehood? Post it here. A link is nice too, but Hitchens, IIRC did not find factual flaws; he disagreed with the conclusions Moore draws, which is, of course, NOT a lie. It's a different opinion.
That's why you are not allowed to practice law.
I don’t follow your link because you failed the truth test. What is the false statement in 911?
I mean, have you ordered it on the basis of viewing the site?
At least with Moore, you know what you're getting!
s
;^)
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