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In Reply to: War of the Worlds------After thoughts. posted by patrickU on July 8, 2005 at 01:44:36:
>>> "Second, In the twenty minutes scene who broke the pace of this film, why had Tom Cruise to kill Tim Robbins? He could have just left him. That is engraved in the logic of Mr . Spielberg, " ready to kill for your familly " yes, but only if absolutely necessary. And that was not the case. Here." <<<FYI, that's not what occured at all.
First of all, the "twenty minutes scene who broke the pace of this film" was a similar to a scene in the earlier 1953 WoTW film in that the main characters are trapped for a time and searched out by the aliens, but this goes further by revealing the invader's intent behind invading the Earth and what motivates them to kill humans.
Secondly, Tim Robbins had become a threat to himself and the survival of Tom Cruise's character and that of his daughter, and as a matter of survival (i.e., remaining undiscovered and escaping from the aliens) his motivations are quite sound.
Follow Ups:
I quite liked Clueless. I hated War of the Worlds.
"First of all, the "twenty minutes scene who broke the pace of this film" was a similar to a scene in the earlier 1953 WoTW film in that the main characters are trapped for a time and searched out by the aliens, but this goes further by revealing the invader's intent behind invading the Earth and what motivates them to kill humans."
It was similar at first with the alien eye tracking them. However when all was said and done it was one of the stupidest parts of a painfully stupid movie. Spielberg couldn't resist using cliches for sheap effect. Hide and seak with an alien probe while the two guys wrestle isn't bad enough, Spielberg had to do the old ridiculus misdirection, Uh oh the alien caught them, TC made noise while hiding behind the mirror and we can see his shoe, what!? no! it's a boot that he happened to find when he was almost caught. Yeah I believe three people could get away from behind a wall mirror while an alien probe is looking right at them without getting caught. All cheap tricks done with camera angles and editing cheats. It was just stupid. Then when you think it couldn't get any more stupid the aliens come out and stroll through the wreckage start naked. One of them even takes a drink of gutter water. Yeah, I buy that. NOT. Could Spielberg have been any more heavy handed in setting up the aliens' demise? You'd think alins with superior technology would build probes with motion dtectors and infra red scanning but no, just near sighted optics."Secondly, Tim Robbins had become a threat to himself and the survival of Tom Cruise's character and that of his daughter, and as a matter of survival (i.e., remaining undiscovered and escaping from the aliens) his motivations are quite sound."
The guy went from rational to bent on self destruction in minutes for no apparent reason.
Spielberg owes me ten bucks.
I will agree that Spielberg used some of his familiar tricks to rev-up suspense in the cellar scene. The hide and seek routine is nothing new in this kind of Spielberg film; it's even reaching the point of being cliche` because it's so predictable. Regrettably, the H&S stunt was employed with the same stylistic flourishes and excesses that he's used in earlier films (i.e., Raptors in the kitchen in Jurassic Park, spider-bots in Minority Report, etc.).OTOH, the terra farming angle was new, and the use of human ash and blood as fertilizer was a very dark, scary idea brought off quite effectively, I thought. I was also impressed and more than a little shocked by the very effective creepiness of the "floaters" in the stream sequence and the "human/rat-catcher" sequence.
On the second point you mentioned I completely differ with your impressions: Tim Robbins character, Harlan Ogilvy, seemed a little off from the start and got progressively creepy. When the aliens investigated the basement and Harlan's warped plans became clear, Tom Cruise's character had to adjust rapidly, from fearful prey to protective father, as Robbin's character seemed the greater threat. After all, Harlan's irrational actions would've eventually lead to everyone's deaths at the hands of the invaders.
Cheers,
AuPh
"I will agree that Spielberg used some of his familiar tricks to rev-up suspense in the cellar scene. The hide and seek routine is nothing new in this kind of Spielberg film; it's even reaching the point of being cliche` because it's so predictable. Regrettably, the H&S stunt was employed with the same stylistic flourishes and excesses that he's used in earlier films (i.e., Raptors in the kitchen in Jurassic Park, spider-bots in Minority Report, etc.)."
So I guess these things are less aggrevating to you than me. nothing wrong with that but I'll get back to that aggrevation later.
'OTOH, the terra farming angle was new, and the use of human ash and blood as fertilizer was a very dark, scary idea brought off quite effectively, I thought."
OK I saw this differently. It seemed to me that the insineration (spelling?) was there for shock value. the blood as fetilizer looked like a selfconflicting twist. I thought it was illogical to destroy a valuable commodity. So you saw a duel purpose. I Think it's a stretch but maybe you saw something I missed there. Anyways I sw it as a bit forced. You can find the same darkness in your garden variety horror film without it feeling forced.
"I was also impressed and more than a little shocked by the very effective creepiness of the "floaters" in the stream sequence and the "human/rat-catcher" sequence.'
didn't it seem way too staged? I thought it did. i like a good shock but soooo many of them in movies are cheats. I have reached a point where cheats just drive me up the wall. I think it is a cheap substitute for well thought out scares with substance. i really admire movies like the Sixth sense where everything was very carefully considered and no cheats were used yet the emotional intent of each scene was preserved.
"On the second point you mentioned I completely differ with your impressions: Tim Robbins character, Harlan Ogilvy, seemed a little off from the start and got progressively creepy. When the aliens investigated the basement and Harlan's warped plans became clear, Tom Cruise's character had to adjust rapidly, from fearful prey to protective father, as Robbin's character seemed the greater threat. After all, Harlan's irrational actions would've eventually lead to everyone's deaths at the hands of the invaders."
I didn't think his plans were warped at all. think about it, without fighting back some how some way the people of earth were doomed without a miracle (lucky earth got one in the end). What bothered me was that he simply turned stupid and was bent on getting caught. The funny thing is, his irrational behavior was putting TC and child in greater danger (nothing a spare boot couldn't fix) but it was his first action, a very rational one, that saved their asses in the first place. that transformation simply felt forced and staged.
Now here's what really burns me up about this movie. you mentioned things being cliche. i think the movie is mostly a string of cliches. All the ridiculous near death escapes, running from falling bridges, swimming from sinking ships, running from fireballs. I'm just sick of this crap. I watched Jaws again over the weekend. What a brilliant movie. It drives me nuts that someone can make movies that good and then end up making things like War of the Worlds. Of course one can find improbablities even in Jaws but nothing of the order of magnitude of todays action movies. NO MORE RUNNING FROM FIRE BALLS PLEASE!!!
So baby, one wrong ( 1953 ) should remain that way ( 2005 ).
So he had to go to Orson / Tin and kill him?
No way.
...from where I sit your efforts clearly emphasize the emphant side of the idiom. ;^)(ahn-FAHN te-REE-bluh) A person who stirs things up in an irresponsible or indiscreet way or has unconventional ideas; also, one whose startlingly unconventional behavior, work, or thought embarrasses or disturbs others. From French, meaning “terrible child.”
> > > "So he had to go to Orson / Tin and kill him?
No way." < < <Something must be lost in translation here (who is "Tin" and if you mean Tim Robbin's character, his name was Harlan Ogilvy).
Yes, ...WAY! Harlan was determined to make his stand right there, even though Ray Ferrier (Cruise) objected to he and his daughter being placed at risk. The Ogilvy character was clearly behaving recklessly and irrationally (i.e., he'd lost it completely), demonstrating no regard for the lives of those he'd offered assistance earlier.
If you still need a clue, I'm sure that others will provide one for you. :o)
Cheers,
AuPh
It get fatiguing.
Not only " enfant terrible " but you " bete noir " it seems....
One has to wonder what sort of souffle our resident Euro-film critic will concoct next; should we start calling you P-diddy (Martha Stewart's ...ahem... pen name)?Note: Souffle is defined as "a savory, open-faced pie made from cheese and eggs."
> > > "It get fatiguing." < < <
Oui, it gets very fatiguing cleaning up the grey poupon spillage; it's a dirty job, but somebody's got to do it. ;^)
Bon apetite,
AuPh
But you really do a good job. Could you please crawl out of the window?
;^)
Yet sometimes I love the sounds of words without any apparent logical background.
BUT this picture show me that sometimes you may have a light tint of humour.
In one word: I like it.
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