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In Reply to: And one other thing posted by jamesgarvin on December 22, 2005 at 08:45:35:
The film is crap, but since you love the crap it is a great film for you!I like that! No absolutes, only slight shades of acceptable!
Your post makes me stand harder on what I said first in this thread - such behavior leads to mediocrity.
In fact, you are not even disagreeing with that... all you seem to be saying that being mediocre is fine... as many people indeed love mediocre.
Follow Ups:
You seem to like strawmen - mischarachtarizing what I wrote, then telling me why I am wrong. I never said or implied that "the film is crap, but since you love the crap it is a great film for you!" Nor do I ever recall Ebert writing that either. I do think that films are inherently subjective. If someone likes a piece of crap, say, the Russian film Mother and Son directed by Sokurov, which I think is one of the two or three worst films I have ever seen, but you love the film, then who is right? If you like the film, then who am I to tell you that you are wrong? If I reviewed the film, I would simply describe the film, and write that watching paint dry was more emotionally and intellectually involving, and if that is your cup of tea, have at it. Why should I care if it a great film for you? My life goes on.Nobody wrote that there were no absolutes, only shades of acceptable. Once again, you have misstated, I assume accidently, what I wrote. Enter into Ebert's website all the films he has given zero through two and a half stars, and there are a litany of films. Some are scathing reviews. Clearly, there are not only shades of acceptable, otherwise everything would be a postive review. But then you would not understand this unless you did the research.
I never wrote that mediocre is fine. Films, like music, and dare I say amplifier design, are inherently subjective. If they were not, then there would be one way of doing them. I would ask you for "absolutes", but then, your list would probably be different than mine. So I am not sure there are absolutes. Maybe for that person. If there are absolutes in amplifier design, then are all the other manufacturers wrong because they do not adhere to your thoughts? Are poor Patrick's Krells deficient in some way, dare I say, mediocre?
Or is your version of "absolutes" open so long as they comport to your opinions? I do not care if people care for what I deem to be mediocre. Why you are so concerned puzzles me. Perhaps your years of growing up in a society in which the government attempted to control actions and thoughts has stunted your growth and ability to appreciate that some things are so inherently subjective, that there are no "answers".
But what is most decidedly not subjective is whether a person is a "shill", or on the take. Which is what you accused Ebert of. Disagreeing with their opinion is the name of the game, but impugning their charachter is not, which you most certainly do when you accuse them of being dishonest. Particularly when you have not the fortitude to do so directly to them. So perhaps you can set forth your evidence that Ebert is a shill. Or maybe enter the world of human beings and retract those comments. And I thought Patrick was critical of name calling. Hmm, maybe he will enter this discussion.
Ebert is a movie lover - Victor is not. Victor has a veyr narrow vision of things - probably in all things outside of movies -- and I would be willing to bet that he is a conservative in his political views as well (as from msot of the people I have met it tends to follow). All things are subject to a narrow box of what is right and good in his world and anything that deviates from that narrow vision is "wrong" in some way.Luckily Ebert is the one they pay the money to, someone who appreciates all genres of films on their terms and evaluates from that basis. He is intelligent, worldly, humane, sensitive, and passionate enough to be a film lover turned film critic who understands what movie making is REALLY about. Victor can't shove his self-appointed small minded, silver spooned ego out of the way to even consider anyone elses opinions of film or anything else, I suspect. You see he doesn't consider that film or art is the least bit subjective -- it is objective in his world view and there is no argument - like arguing with the ultra right wing Religious set, he is the sole dicatator of what is considered right and moral and which Art is good and which art is not. And if you can live your life in a pompous enough way you may actually believe in the artifical superiority God Complex you've provided for yourself. Until you realise that the paper thin ego has little intellect behind the posts. He can't address any of your literary criticim arguments because that would have required him to understand what literary criticism really is so instead you get terse and vague commentary written in a condescending manner to seem "elite" enough to poo-poo everyone else.
***...I would be willing to bet that he is a conservative in his political views as wellHe would not dare!
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