And why the books too were so unsatisfactory. None of them bear comparison the to the One True Ring, viz., Wagner's. Here's a brilliant dissertation, only excerpted here. Well worth reading for the Oscar Wilde remark alone!---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THE RING AND THE RINGS
by ALEX ROSS (The New Yorker)
Wagner vs. Tolkien
...Tolkien refused to admit that his ring had anything to do with Wagner’s. “Both rings were round, and there the resemblance ceased,†he said. But he certainly knew his Wagner, and made an informal study of “Die Walküre†not long before writing the novels. The idea of the omnipotent ring must have come directly from Wagner; nothing quite like it appears in the old sagas. True, the Volsunga Saga features a ring from a cursed hoard, but it possesses no executive powers. In the “Nibelungenlied†saga, there is a magic rod that could be used to rule all, but it just sits around. Wagner combined these two objects into the awful amulet that is forged by Alberich from the gold of the Rhine. When Wotan steals the ring for his own godly purposes, Alberich places a curse upon it, and in so doing he speaks of “the lord of the ring as the slave of the ring.†Such details make it hard to believe Tolkien’s disavowals. Admit it, J.R.R., you used to run around brandishing a walking stick and singing “Nothung! Nothung!†like every other besotted Oxford lad.
It is surely no accident that the notion of a Ring of Power surfaced in the late nineteenth century, when technologies of mass destruction were appearing on the horizon. Pre-modern storytellers had no frame of reference for such things. Power, for them, was not a baton that could be passed from one person to another; those with power were born with power, and those without, without. By Wagner’s time, it was clear that a marginal individual would soon be able to unleash terror with the flick of a wrist. Oscar Wilde issued a memorable prediction of the war of the future: “A chemist on each side will approach the frontier with a bottle.†Nor did the ring have to be understood only in terms of military science. Mass media now allowed for the worldwide destruction of an idea, a reputation, a belief system, a culture. In a hundred ways, men were forging things over which they had no control, and which ended up controlling them...
I hope that at least a small fraction of the huge worldwide audiences for these films will one day be tempted into Wagner’s world, which offers something else again. For Tolkien, myth is a window on an ideal world, both brighter and blacker than our own. For Wagner, it is a magnifying mirror for the average, desperate modern soul...
When Tolkien stole Wagner’s ring, he discarded its most significant property—that it can be forged only by one who has forsworn love. (Presumably, Sauron gave up carnal pleasures when he became an all-seeing eye at the top of a tower, but it’s hard to say for certain. Maybe he gets a kick out of the all-seeing bit.)... The ring is a never-ending nightmare to which people are drawn for no obvious reason. It generates lust and yet gives no satisfaction...
The apparatus of myth itself—the belief in higher and lower powers, hierarchies, orders—crumbles with the walls of Valhalla. Perhaps what angered Tolkien most was that Wagner wrote a sixteen-hour mythic opera and then, at the end, blew up the foundations of myth.
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Topic - Someone's really good explanation of why LOTR has bored me and so many others. - clarkjohnsen 13:50:15 12/21/03 (87)
- finally read the original article - tunenut 21:03:46 12/27/03 (0)
- Re: Someone's really good explanation of why LOTR has bored me and so many others. - Czish 11:54:05 12/25/03 (3)
- Perhaps if the movies were in black and white and subtitled........... (nt - dennzio 16:17:27 12/25/03 (2)
- Re: Many EXCELLENT films - rico 07:09:14 12/26/03 (1)
- Can you detect sarcasm? (nt - dennzio 12:55:50 12/26/03 (0)
- Quite simply, it's a yarn for - tinear 05:28:01 12/23/03 (34)
- W. H. Auden didn't think so. - Harmonia 19:53:45 12/23/03 (0)
- Then Homer and Virgil will be over your head also. (nt - dennzio 12:55:09 12/23/03 (3)
- So now you've sunk to comparing the blind one and his - tinear 13:15:31 12/23/03 (2)
- The Aeneid was of course Virgil as a Homer wannabe. - dennzio 17:12:28 12/23/03 (1)
- PS: you can teach me about D&D someday. (nt - dennzio 17:13:35 12/23/03 (0)
- Did you people really miss the philosophical dimension of this epic? - Tadlo 07:40:46 12/23/03 (28)
- Doesn't it have to do with insufficient water? - geoffkait 09:06:03 12/23/03 (0)
- This is exactly WHAT'S wrong WITH it! - Troy 08:30:06 12/23/03 (19)
- Not entirely predictable - Tadlo 16:14:00 12/23/03 (0)
- YOU GOT THAT RIGHT! And long live Wagner. nt - clarkjohnsen 14:31:35 12/23/03 (1)
- Re: YOU GOT THAT RIGHT! And long live Wagner./The antisemit bastard.nt - patrickU 02:41:16 12/25/03 (0)
- With all due respect, you are rudely mistaken. - Audiophilander 10:08:00 12/23/03 (15)
- Re: With all due respect, you are rudely mistaken. - Troy 10:50:44 12/23/03 (14)
- You offered no real valid literary criticisms, just a very average personal opinion, how could anybody take offense? - dennzio 13:24:40 12/23/03 (0)
- "BBs are designed for people to put forth their opinions" - Well, one hopes that those opinions would be informed! - Audiophilander 11:46:31 12/23/03 (12)
- BwaaHAAAAAAAA! - Troy 13:06:02 12/23/03 (11)
- Re: BwaaHAAAAAAAA! - Tadlo 16:23:00 12/23/03 (0)
- And just to show . . . - Troy 13:37:07 12/23/03 (9)
- Yep, missed that one. - Audiophilander 14:47:32 12/23/03 (8)
- You missed this too - Troy 15:27:24 12/23/03 (7)
- I'll accept your intent, but let's get the impression straight. - Audiophilander 22:19:30 12/24/03 (6)
- Look past your "red haze" - Troy 11:42:27 12/25/03 (5)
- "If I was a troll, I'd have handled my responses differently than I have, goading you even further." LOL! - Audiophilander 23:54:12 12/25/03 (4)
- Hey, I'm just playing nice here - Troy 17:29:54 12/26/03 (3)
- One last time; I'll see your nice ante and raise it as politely as I can: - Audiophilander 00:48:27 12/27/03 (2)
- We just don't see eye to eye - Troy 08:42:43 12/27/03 (1)
- "chasing windmills" ...? Wrong movie; wrong book! Terry Gilliam has thus far failed where Peter Jackson succeeded. - Audiophilander 09:21:51 12/29/03 (0)
- Yup, just like I missed the great sociological insights of - tinear 08:03:52 12/23/03 (6)
- Well, there is this small difference - Tadlo 08:33:00 12/23/03 (5)
- Au contraire. The sociological insights ARE - tinear 12:03:17 12/23/03 (2)
- Re: Au contraire. The sociological insights ARE - Tadlo 16:39:24 12/23/03 (1)
- Ok, fair knight, I yield the field. But still, I think Mallory's much - tinear 11:57:43 12/24/03 (0)
- Re: And didn't Wagner... - rico 10:28:29 12/23/03 (1)
- One knows one has stumbled into fantasy-land when - tinear 11:59:14 12/23/03 (0)
- I must have missed something... - Tadlo 21:23:02 12/22/03 (1)
- A fair question. See my remarks just below. nt - clarkjohnsen 14:29:37 12/23/03 (0)
- Even if his thesis is true - Bulkington 10:53:23 12/22/03 (1)
- "I don't see the argument." OK... - clarkjohnsen 10:01:30 12/23/03 (0)
- Clark Johnson: The Micro Brain with the Macro Mouth - Yo Mama 09:43:23 12/22/03 (12)
- Hey, Clark might not know a good flick when it hits him in the chops.... - dennzio 10:00:02 12/22/03 (11)
- "Zero respect for the nastiness." Thanks, but... - clarkjohnsen 09:51:47 12/23/03 (5)
- "Yo Mama is suffering through pubesence" How generous of you, Clark! "Take pity" So says our compassionate curmudgeon... - Audiophilander 12:06:35 12/23/03 (4)
- Hey, you can't fault a guy who likes toy trains. (nt - dennzio 12:57:04 12/23/03 (3)
- Or toy audio systems? nt - clarkjohnsen 14:50:59 12/23/03 (2)
- Or overpriced tea. (nt - dennzio 04:59:30 12/24/03 (1)
- So, you've had it? And you *know*? Details, please. nt - clarkjohnsen 09:58:43 12/26/03 (0)
- Right on both counts and comment on reviewer BS - Yo Mama 12:41:26 12/22/03 (3)
- Then comment ont this... - dennzio 13:37:05 12/22/03 (2)
- Re: Then comment ont this... - Yo Mama 16:18:15 12/22/03 (1)
- Thanks. (nt - dennzio 17:24:00 12/22/03 (0)
- Hold on, dennzio! - Audiophilander 10:45:56 12/22/03 (0)
- That's not it - Troy 08:47:02 12/22/03 (0)
- There is a big difference between fantasy and myth, at least as I define it. - Audiophilander 23:06:14 12/21/03 (9)
- "As for Mr. Ross's opinion..." - clarkjohnsen 09:27:52 12/22/03 (7)
- Excuse me, but I thought that this was the Video Asylum Film Forum. - Audiophilander 10:32:54 12/22/03 (6)
- "...a stuffed shirt music critic's opinion." LOL! As low-brow as you've become... - clarkjohnsen 09:47:51 12/23/03 (5)
- Three responses to date? Indeed, I'm impressed; your audience is growing! - Audiophilander 10:39:52 12/23/03 (4)
- Three *intelligent* responses. Makes all the difference. - clarkjohnsen 14:53:41 12/23/03 (3)
- The difference is that you've succeeded in making asterisks out of your three supporters. (nt) - Audiophilander 22:29:05 12/24/03 (0)
- Oh giggle! Severius. You two deserve each other's admiration. (nt - dennzio 05:03:21 12/24/03 (1)
- Bad dennzio, ...bad, bad! - Audiophilander 22:45:28 12/24/03 (0)
- Re: There is a big difference between fantasy and myth, at least as I define it. - rico 08:09:14 12/22/03 (0)
- Re: Maybe... - Dave-A 20:29:53 12/21/03 (10)
- "Do you like foreign films?" LOL! Yes! - clarkjohnsen 09:21:26 12/22/03 (9)
- Re: All good films? - Dave-A 15:54:59 12/26/03 (0)
- Only thing worth smiling about was Johnny Depp. (nt - dennzio 09:52:53 12/22/03 (0)
- Re: How can one smile at the " Pirates of the Caribics " for - patrickU 09:37:29 12/22/03 (6)
- Rarely do I find myself supporting one of Clark's assertions, but... - Audiophilander 11:02:29 12/22/03 (5)
- Re: Rarely do I find myself supporting one of Clark's assertions, but... - patrickU 11:16:22 12/22/03 (4)
- Perhaps you would prefer Master and Commander. - dennzio 12:03:21 12/22/03 (1)
- Re: Perhaps you would prefer Master and Commander. - patrickU 12:27:21 12/22/03 (0)
- Sorry, but I beg to differ. - Audiophilander 11:33:32 12/22/03 (1)
- Re: May your wishes comes true... - patrickU 11:41:03 12/22/03 (0)
- This was the quote that caught my eye last week... - Harmonia 19:29:30 12/21/03 (1)
- "Repeated attempts in the intervening years have not changed muy mind." - clarkjohnsen 09:11:01 12/22/03 (0)
- If the movie bores you so much, why do you keep commenting on it? - Dalton 17:22:48 12/21/03 (2)
- Thge comments were Alex Ross's. nt - clarkjohnsen 09:16:02 12/22/03 (1)
- So? Does one need to post individual reviews which concur with one's preconceived notions... - Audiophilander 09:44:19 12/22/03 (0)
- Get over it. It's a movie. Eat some beans. (nt - dennzio 14:21:23 12/21/03 (2)
- Boston half-baked beans... - Audiophilander 08:08:30 12/22/03 (1)
- Some folks fancy themselves as the high brow set. - dennzio 09:50:40 12/22/03 (0)